emarori - March 20, 2006 04:53 AM (GMT)
Druid (resto) class mentor is Ishonbu.
Ayngle - March 20, 2006 08:00 AM (GMT)
That reminds me. Ish do you use healing toucher? I was thinking of grabbing it for those "oh crap" moments.
Ishonbu - March 20, 2006 03:10 PM (GMT)
wth is healing toucher? :blink:
Ishonbu - March 20, 2006 03:18 PM (GMT)
The art of the resto druid: :ph43r:
1) Fall asleep in the middle of a raid.
2) Walk out to the store to get chocolate in the middle of a raid.
3) Blame Matron for -everything-
4) Innervate Self... or really... any priest but Matron.
5) Forget to bring seeds for battle rez
6) Bring about 100 reagents and spam GotW on people
7) Still manage to miss someone and have them say in vent/raidchat/mcchatter that they need "paw."
8) Face stabbing/mauling is your friend.
9) Make sure your decursive button is EXTRA loud so that when you're trying to talk on vent and decurse at the same time all the other people can here is click, click, click, click
:oops: Ok I'll make a real post about what seems to work for me later when I've had breakfast and am awake. Hrm.. the awake part may never happen... I need a caffeine IV drip.. stat!
Ishonbu - March 20, 2006 03:53 PM (GMT)
Oookay I looked up healing toucher....
I used something similar (until it broke when I got that new rank of rejuv ~_~) called Healer which does calculate the right rank of all three heals to use... it's being replaced by something called "genesis" for the next patch which will remove the overhealing auto-stop that both healer, master healer (another type of healing mod) and ctraid have built in.
Onto the heals.
General Healing stuffs
I only really use healing touch when Nature's swiftness is up or if the raid healing is on point and I can afford to take the extra few milliseconds to heal someone.
NS + HT = MT from 1% health to 75%+
NS + HT = anyone else to full or close to it.
I use rejuv and regrowth like they're going out of style. The mana conservation comes with the addons especially for rejuv... most likely someone's going to heal over your HoT and it's best not to waste a high level one on someone if it's only going to go for one tick and then be rendered useless by someone else in the raid healing.
I've found that I use healing touch more in ZG because it's easier to manage 20 people's health and use the slower heals. Using healing touch is far and above the most "mana efficient" way to heal. Your target, however, might be dead before you get it off.
The highest rank of Healing Touch is cheaper mana-wise than regrowth and you get the full heal out without worrying about the HoT.
Regrowth is great for when you know the person is going to be beaten on again in the next 12 seconds and you want to make sure that bit of initial heal can be maintained with the HoT.
I use Nature's swiftness + HT every time it's up in MC because there is -always- going to be someone who's at very low health who might die without a big heal ( for this I normally target a rogue or mage)
I have my main rejuv bound to the ] key and my main regrowth bound to the [ key
rank 9, 10 of Healing touch are on the - and = keys respectively. Another rank of regrowth is my f12 key. THat gives me a nice little area where my fingers don't have to move so much if I need to change up the heal.
I use Decursive. You can also use the built in thing from ctraid but I like decursive and it treats me right. :P
Make sure you update your priority list at the beginning of the raid and for raggy.. it really helps getting the right people decursed at the right time.
My decursive button is bound to the \ key.
Ishonbu - March 20, 2006 04:08 PM (GMT)
I -love- ctraid.. couldn't live without it..
besides the boss mods it has advanced whack-a-mole (otherwise know as healing) help.
1) If you mouse over the buff shown on the ctraid frame it will estimate the amount of time left on each person's buff. So when I do a spot check for GotW and see that someone has 8 minutes left of it I rebuff the group soon after. (I love this)
2) The Emergency monitor...
Not only does it show the top 5 most injured players in your raid... you can bind keys to target all 5 using the keybindings menu of the game.
I have my f9-f11 keys bound to the top 3 which really helps when you know that if the top person is the MT then you should probably get one of the other two because everyone's gonna be like omg i r healz0rs MT b4 they deadded.... or something
again these keys are all in the general area of where my healing keys are and I'm able to use my right hand for it all (I'm left handed [mostly] and at home use the mouse in my left.. work it's right but that's not really interesting or neccessary for this)
3) MT targets... great for seeing how the core hound packs are doing and general raid announcements. Also great to see how much longer you have to heal before you can rest when you can see the boss's health steadily decrease without targetting him.
With ctraid and my small 18 inch monitor (finally got rid of the other larger, but very broken one) i find that removing all of the frills from the frames (border and such) helps optimize the space they're in. I put all 8 parties on the right side of of my screen... sometimes I like it better when I have all the classes shown, but it's annoying to switch back to group view when buffing or sort of just go down the priest list and buff till none of the bars are missing GotW.
Ishonbu - March 20, 2006 04:26 PM (GMT)
Ok, I'll be the first to admit I'm not really lacking any gear.... but it wasn't always so...
The first thing to note about gear is that it mainly helps your mana conservation FIRST and your overall healing ability second.
When I just had full Wildheart I would still be near the top of the healing meters (and absolutely manaless) once I figured out what healing style worked for me and learned who to focus on in the battle.
With that said.. my little titan item bonuses says I currently have around +513 to healing in my "normal" gear. I never use my max healing gear since I like the extra mana Cenarion ( http://thottbot.com/?i=27744)
gives me over the Wild growth spaulders ( http://thottbot.com/?i=37480)
(I am a mana whore and I don't feel like buying another 15 bijous for the wild growth shoulders too >.>)
Ok also.. my Cenarion has the +33 healing enchant from being Exalted with Zandalar
Wild growth has the +5 FR, but I still don't take cenarion off (be the tree).
Moving on to the other gear:
I use the primalist's set from ZG for my rings when not in FR gear.
Band ( http://thottbot.com/?i=51420
) 8 stam, 10 int, 6 mana/5s
Seal ( http://thottbot.com/?i=51330)
12 int, 8 spi, healing by up to 29
set bonus: healing by spells and effects + 33 (additional to the one on the seal)
before I had the set i used two fordring's seals ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=18600)
and probably some other combination of things from the 5-10 man end game instances. I had just the band for a very long time and would use that with one of the seals which actually gives a better +healing bonus by a few points but then you miss out on the 6mp5
For my chest piece i have the Revered Zandalarian thingie.. ummm ( http://thottbot.com/?i=51600
) The Haruspex's tunic. (healing + 33)
I totally forget what enchant I have on it (if any) but I use it with the bracers (healing +22) for the 4 mana/5 second 2 piece bonus ( http://thottbot.com/?i=51598
the bracers also have the +healing enchant on them >.> we're seeing a trend here.
Neck! ookay for the longest time i used the Choker of Enlightenment ever since I got it way back when on a Haven MC run ( i think... I'm foggy) which has damage + healing +18 ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=26483)
Then one day I poked Jin'do's eye out and now I use this ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=51263)
which has healing +44
Umm.. what's left?
for the longest time i used the Animist's pants ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=51201
, +35 healing).. and this goes for the shoulders too ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=51086
, +37 healing).. they both have very great +healing stats...
I never got the animist boots before cenarion dropped for me but I -did- use the quest reward ones from killing the emissary in Silithus for a good long while (cause they rock the socks off of WH)
Sandstorm Boots ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=52052
, damage/healing +14, 4mp5)
Also a good thing to note.. the pants rewarded from this quest are awesome too:
Reservist's Leggings ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=52128
, healing +29, +25 NR aq o.o?)
Anyway then I used Cenarion for a good long while and still use it for FR. ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=27475
, 4mp5, healing +22)
My Stormrage legguards currently don't have an enchant on them.. I might put the animist's caress on them but eh.. I'm lazy. ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=38128
, healing +48, 6mp5)
And the moose ears ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=27628
)... they have the animist's caress ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=51865)
on them (10 stm, 10 int, healing +24 on head or leg [same spot as the FR thing sadly])
Weapon... ok I've got corn.. we all know I've got the corn with the smart butter dripping from it.
It is the -best- resto druid staff out there minus that lovely one from Nef and somethings in AQ 20 but it's still delicious. And dammit. it looks like corn.. or pineapple.. or whatever..
Staff of Rampant growth ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=52191
, +84 healing 11mp5)
I put the +22 int enchant on this one...
Before this I used... the will of Arlokk.. the first time we ever killed her she dropped it and then REFUSED to do so for like 2 months afterwards~_~ ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=51764)
I still use the will for mana regen when I innervate myself and remember. I put the +20 spirit enchant on it for a total of +55 spirit on that baby. With all my other normal gear on it gives me ~ 450/tick with innervate in combat (I think). When it was my main weapon I had the +22 int on it.
Before I had those two I used the Trindlehaven staff ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=5291)
from LBRS for months and months and months... I drooled over a GBS but really.. with the +int enchant on the Trindlehaven it almost rivals the GBS in stats. It's like the poor man's GBS and I likes it.
Dancing sliver is also and option ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=18883)
again a + int enchant won't steer you wrong.
ok I still use the Flayed Doomguard belt ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=40404
, healing/damage +14) I got from Kazzak during one of the Insane Raids of last summer. It has better +healing than Cenarion so that only comes out when FR gear is on.
If you can find it as a world drop... the Sash of Mercy is great for healing ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=24402
, healing +53).
Cloak... I use the Hide of the Wild ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=36157)
umm i don't remember if it has any enchants on it though.
Before that I might have just used...hell I dunno... it's been a long while.
There's a cloak that drops from azuregos that is equal if not better than the HotW in certain cases : Drape of Benediction ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=40019
gloves! I almost forgot...
I use the cenarion gloves and never really take them off.. they've got +healing as well ( http://www.thotbott.com/?i=27124
, +18 healing)
Ishonbu - March 20, 2006 04:54 PM (GMT)
Since that last post was really long I made another one to discuss the fun trinkets you can use.
First off.. if you have your DM trinket book.. get that quest done.
The royal seal is amazing for FR and for healing ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=38431
, healing+44) I use it in my FR gear
For normal everyday healing I use the Zandalarian hero charm ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=51326)
and my blue dragon card ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=40830
, procs like an extra innervate... it's yummy when they're both up at the same time.).
I have a twisting nether card too ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=40867)
, but since I stopped doing PuGs for the most part ... I don't use it that often.. Maybe MAYBE if I was the only rezzer I'd put it on in case we wipe in place of the other card or the charm... but I haven't used it in a long time
Ishonbu - March 20, 2006 05:21 PM (GMT)
Lots of the Cenarion stuff has FR on it
I wear the belt, the chestpiece ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=37303)
, the pants ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=27475)
cause I have the fr enchant on them ( i think.. I forgot), the gloves ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=27124)
, the shoulders ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=27744)
cause I like em even withouth the +fr enchant
belt, gloves = +7 each, + 14 fr
chest = +10 fr
I also wear the onyxia scale cloak ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=36050)
which we're still working on getting made for everyone. + 16 fr with the +7 fr enchant
I have the tidal loop ring from the Waterlords quest chain ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=35685)
= +15 fr
For neckpiece I use the Elder Magus Pendant from DM ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=35769)
even though I have the ony key/necklace with +15 fr ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=4829)i
like having int on my neck piece for the mana I lose when switching to fr gear
You can use either and be fine
This is also when I use my royal seal of eldre'thalas ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=38431
, healing+44) + 10 fr
It replaces the Zandalarian charm since I never remember to use that on raggy anyway.
For bracers I have the cinderhide thingy of the owl, i think ( http://www.thotbott.com/?i=18796)
but if you get one to drop you should use it no matter what the stats for a while ( I had one of stamina before) +10 fr
I think I keep my primalist's seal on for this but the band gets replaced with the tidal loop above
Our MotW gives +27 to all resistances so that's lovely
for a chest piece you can also use Flamestrider robes ( http://www.thotbott.com/?i=9903)
which i found a few weeks after I already had the cenarion chest.
The good thing about being a druid with this group is that Cenarion will fall from the sky so you probably won't have to go searching for anything additional in a few weeks.
with all my fr gear on I have 182 with the Pally aura fully buffed.
Also a good note.. with this much fr you can sort of go into bear form and pull a son off of someone squishy to 1) remove your mana pool from the equation so they can't mana burn it all away and 2) bash something for fun because 3) their fire stuff doesn't hurt so much with fr gear ^_^
Ishonbu - March 20, 2006 05:36 PM (GMT)
Oookay that's really all I can think of right now.. oh.. I'll post my talents when I remember what the hell I have when I get home, but the great thing about being a druid is that the spec isn't -quite- so important once you figure out what you're comfortable with and just sort of go at it. Other than that, feel free to ask me any questions about stuff. I don't bite... much.
Ishonbu - March 20, 2006 05:53 PM (GMT)
some final whatevers
I was asked when it was best to use an innervate or a battle rez in raiding and really it's all situational.
MT is down? burn it right away... hopefully you have ctraid and the res monitor up because it'll warn you when someone's being rezzed. It is entirely possible for two druids to burn their rezzes on a single person because there's no "this person has already been rezzed" stop on it. That sucks.
If the offtank/goalie is dead most likely it's time to battle rez.
MT healer without a soulstone... rez them if it's early on in the battle.
MT healer with a soulstone? You'd better have ctraid to know that they have one :P otherwise you wipe their soulstone and waste a rez.
Lots of people are dead but the mob is at low health? Rez a healer if there's fewer of them and the MT is still up. rez the MT if the person currently holding the aggro is running around screaming for their mommy. Rez an offtank if they're still needed and no one is available.
Lots of people are dead and you're the only other druid up and the other druid has their battle rez handy... rez the druid
Some people are dead and there are dead druids with battle rez up.. rez them.
Lastly... if I pull aggro when something gets loose early (like on garr) rez me >.> Otherwise my innervate lies unused and well yeah... healer down :P
I have no subtlety spec (currently, I'm considering changing, but I do so like feral charge >.>) so if I get a heal out and a mob's not corralled I usually get hate >.>
Also I always get hate on domo... sometimes I live through it. :spastic:
And i used to have issues with finding people to rez them ( and still do if they're in the lava). If they haven't released a /target person /follow will work just like finding a living person in the area. otherwise i target them with the raid window and then run around clicking on my rez button the same way I do when Anowyyn's off on the other side of the room and I need to innervate.
Some raids assign innervaters to people because they have so many and they don't want to double up.
I say.. meh.
Watch the priests and innervate them if they're low and you feel like it. On boss fights.. you'd better use it on a priest unless they're all dead. On trash fights.. I can't say I do.. I use it to have less downtime in between the pulls and most of our priests conserve their mana quite well and don't need it for these.
My innervatee of choice is Anowyyn cause we're in the same group and i can just F# and click innervate (I learned very very early not to have this on my main number bar because... yeah I mispress all the time.)
Sometimes Matron'll beg for one, but only innervate him if he's actually healing :P
Ayngle - March 21, 2006 07:58 AM (GMT)
Just a note for you Feral types,
(the following is based on a raid spec meaning you have 5 point in Heart of the Wild and Leader of the Pack)
First and foremost do not gimp yourself by gearing for only one spec. You may love tanking but believe me you will be called upon to do healing and with the amount of capable Warriors we have you may spend more time doing DPS. Gear for all all forms and occassions. Takes alot of bag space but thats the price we pay.
Now then for those that have not discovered this yet our formulas for ultimate happiness are as follows...
1 str = 2.4 ap
1 agi = 1 ap (kitty form only)
20 agi = 1% to crit and dodge
14 ap = 1 DPS
When working in a DPS role I stuck with 'of the tiger' gear until the epix with agi and str started dropping. A good balance of agi and str is a must. Being able to kill something in 3 swings does no good if you miss half the time likewise a weak crit does nothing more than make a yellow number flash on your screen. I didnt worry so much about sta because dodge is a fantastic thing.
When tanking my choices switched from Agi / Str gear to Armor/ Sta / Str / Agi in that order. Fuzzy tanks have a neat way of grabbing agro just by changing into bear form and keeping agro on multiple targets is really easy if specced for it.
(special note, if you are not asked to tank then dont pop into bearform and start swinging. If you crit you will yank aggro at times and this will wipe a raid fast.)
As for those times you are doing the caster bit dont be surprised or gloat when you have a mana pool as large as the regular finger wigglers that wear better gear. They have talents to optimize mana and will still be healing/nuking while you are wishing you had a mana pot :P
Before I forget. Dont bother with weapons or enchants that proc or have "chance on hit" because they will not have any effect in forms. The same goes for weapon speed, dps and ap.
Maybe Ill add to this later. Happy shredding.
Elhonna - March 23, 2006 07:04 AM (GMT)
So, in my limited time this past week (which has all been outside of raid times.. :( Depending on my operatin systems project, I may return to raiding somewhat Monday), I've been playing around with a druid. She's only 14 right now, but I'd like to go feral, and was wondering what Ayngle (and others) thought of this build.Proposed Feral druid build
My thoughts for going against a few conventional wisdom points, tell me I'm a newb if I deserve it. :P
skipping [Natural Shapeshifter] and [Furor] -- I know sometimes you shift in and out of forms to heal yourself, but do you do it often enough to make either talent worth it?
skipping [Brutal Impact] -- I dunno, but lengthening the stun by a second (especially a one-shot stun for cat form that precludes me from ripping) doesn't seem worth it to me. I see this talent in almost every feral build, maybe I'm wrong.
[Omen of Clarity] -- I've heard varying reports on it's proc rate. Any input?
[Improved Thorns] -- I personally like damage shields, especially when they can be cast on others. For your standard 2.0 speed mob, at max rank of thorns it's another 7dps or so to *every* meleeing mob.
So, any feedback would be nice. >_>
Ayngle - March 23, 2006 03:36 PM (GMT)
Neat. You are actually kinda close to my own spec.
A couple of things though and these are dependant on what you intend to do with your Druid....
Imp Thorns is fun when doing lower lvl instances and it helps you hold aggro while in Bear Form but in endgame you (as a feral) wont be using it much. PvP yes, in raids more than likely a Resto or Balance Druid will be putting it on the Tanks. Not you.
Omen of Clarity is good stuff but again, that point can be put somewhere else easily and you would never miss it even if you plan on doing nothing but PvP. The bonus you get from it when it procs and you get a nice Ferocious Bite off are awesome but that brings me to one of the things I see missing from your Feral Talents....
Feral Agression is a good thing. You want this. In any situation a Demo Roar is nice to throw out, This talent also improves the damage caused by Ferocious Bite.
(Btw I dont know if you are planning on going Bear or Kitty or both so I am trying to make points on all forms just in case)
Words cant describe how much I agree with you on Brutal Impact. Useless talent unless you are a 30/21 Feral Hybrid doing nothing but PvP.
Natural Shapeshifter is very useful if you plan on PvPing also. Otherwise spend the points elsewhere. You wont be switching forms so often that the mana loss is a huge pain and with Heart of the Wild you will care even less.
Furor...... Thats a tough one. I recently gave up Furor so I could have Imp MoW and there are times when I miss it. Not often really. Just getting used to not having the instant rage and energy.
Oh BTW. Get Imp MotW. Its a damn good talent and I used to hate asking other Druids to buff my party when I didnt have it. (Thanks Ish and Xx) If you arent going to get it then at least give the other Druids Roots so they arent spending their money to cover for you.
Hmmmm.... understand this is all based on your character at lvl 60 so I have endgame raids in mind. You could get rid of all but the basic Bearform talents and focus on Kitty form stuffs and do great. Very rarely will you be asked to tank in place of a Warrior. This makes Feral Instinct alot less important. Sure keep the talent until you start raiding mostly, Its fantastic in most game content, but all but useless in endgame.
I hope some of this was actually helpful. If you have anymore questions or want any opinion from me just ask :D
Elhonna - March 23, 2006 04:56 PM (GMT)
The feedback is helpful. :D Though, a few points/questions about it:
[Imp. Thorns] -- Do many other druids take this for end-game raiding? If so, I suppose I could drop it for then and allow them to do it.
[Feral Aggression] -- Think I should take (at least) the 3 points out of [Thick Hide] and place them in here? I haven't tanked an instance yet at 14, but soloing I don't use Demo Roar much and I wasn't sure how large a part of DPS Ferocious Bite was.
[Imp. MotW] -- From everything I've read, this talent is sub-par while leveling (you get very little return on lower ranks of MotW). Plus, I'll buy thorns and such for other druids to cast Imp. GotW, but I feel I've paid my dues casting Divine Spirit on the entire raid the past couple months. :P
Ayngle - March 23, 2006 05:28 PM (GMT)
The thing about Thorns, Imp or not , is that the damage is so small it really isnt worth using those wonderful talent points in it rather than things that will actually be helpful.
Ferocious Bite will be used all the time. Everytime you get 5 combo points on a mob you will use it. The only time I dont is when we fight bosses and that is only because Rip actually does more damage but takes longer to do it. This also means we dont pull aggro off the tank.
The Imp MotW makes a bigger dif than most think. Just ask matron and Ish how many times I said I missed it. Also when you die in a raid or some of the party has and they run back to keep fighting you really dont want the Restos to have to waste mana rebuffing. Just a thought. I went without it until about 2 weeks ago. just dont want you to fight with yourself over it like I did ^^
Xxelisha - March 28, 2006 11:36 PM (GMT)
Holy cow su mutch info thanks ishonbu and ayngle .
Ishonbu - March 29, 2006 12:14 AM (GMT)
Imp thorns + the cenarion bonus = eh... it's good.. but really? pft.
Ayngle - April 14, 2006 05:36 PM (GMT)
Another word of advice.... Dont roll Feral.
Its a god awful road to follow. Trust me. Oh and no I am not joking. Ask me ingame sometime :peace:
Matron - April 14, 2006 06:33 PM (GMT)
|QUOTE (Ayngle @ Apr 14 2006, 11:36 AM)|
| Another word of advice.... Dont roll Feral.|
Its a god awful road to follow. Trust me. Oh and no I am not joking. Ask me ingame sometime :peace:
Sylarae - April 20, 2006 01:01 AM (GMT)
mhm. 'cause sometimes you gotta wonder if that rogue is a rogue, or if they're just a druid who doesn't know any better.
also: for a short while before I respecced to support a lesser emphasis on PvE (the build was originally made back when I was level 56) and more PvP I used improved thorns. The extra damage DOES help a bit, but mostly in PvE environments. It helps hold aggro, and does a little crowd control as well (the groups of bugs in diremaul hate it.) But in PvP it is essentially just purge fodder.
Thick hide can be nice. However, given the obnoxious amounts of armor some leather gives (mostly epic end game) its not totally neccessary. [I]the only reason I have the talent is because I don't have the armor to back up effective bear form damage midigation in PvP and grind sessions.
Improved mark of the wild has it's uses. In terms of raiding though if you don't have it another druid probably will. The alternative entry level restoration talent gives more benefit to feral druids if I remember correctly.
My 2 cents on the cat form finishing moves:
Ferocious Bite is nice if you know for a fact that you won't have any other needs in cat form. In otherwords its best in PvE environments. That doesn't mean its nice when you just want to get some burst DPS off on a caster in PvP but I find that I like it more for PvE.
Rip (rake? its the DOT finisher) has more practicality against plate / mail users. (for the unaware DOTs ignore armor to the best of my knowledge) With that said cat form isn't terribly viable in PvP, or at least for long periods of time. Warriors are just as likely to three shot you in cat form as they are in caster form.
Oh, and for great justice: my hawt druid end game raid / PvP talent build!bur
Ayngle - April 20, 2006 05:42 AM (GMT)
Disregarding whatever that first comment was supposed to mean...
Imp thorns is crap. It has no use after lvl 40 or so except as garnish for tanks. It doesnt do enough damage to matter and the "helps keep aggro" is still questionable. Its simply not worth the talent points at higher lvls unless you are a spec that leaves you with extra and you are strictly support.
Thick hide, although less effective at higher armor ratings is still going to make the people healing you a little less stressed. Thats a good thing.
Get imp Mark. If you are a PvP build or a raider you will have times when you wish you had it. Often to. When you die you cast on yourself and dont bug others, when alone you still have the same benefits, when in PvP you can buff the group and not be doing it half assed. Yeah the feral talent alt is nice but is really only useful in PvP. In raid scenarios the instant rage or energy isnt going to be that useful. Especially if you have the talents that make rage/energy multiply with crits etc.
As far as FB and Rake are concerned I always use FB in every situation when its ready. Like I said earlier Rake is only good for bosses and even then only if I know they arent going to heal themselves. Even against armored types my FB still crits at around 1200dmg. Yeah its less than normal but still better than waiting 30 seconds for Rake to be healed over. Heck the only PvP fights Ive been in that even last that long are against other Druids and in those cases we are both in Bearform.
So yeah. Take from that what you want.
Sylarae - April 20, 2006 11:37 PM (GMT)
ok, ok so FB can be useful. I've never gone heavy feral speccing, and I have never had a full feral set (probably wont either. I like my spells too much) so from the hybrid PvP stand point I find my DOTs more useful. A warrior with rake, rip, moonfire, and insect swarm looses alot of HP fast.
In otherwords my post was in sheer ignorance of what heavy ferals can do.
Sylarae - May 2, 2006 10:20 PM (GMT)
zomg breaking news:http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.a...mp=1#post863036
apparently the long time 31 talent point restoration talent ability innervate is becoming a core ability for druids.
Ishonbu - May 2, 2006 11:11 PM (GMT)
yep... i'm wating to see the full specs on the new 31 point talent swiftmend before I make any judgements.
basically I see it as a benefit to all types of druids and predict a lot of shifting among most that are now free to put their talents elsewhere.
If the 31 point talent is as good as I think it could be, there's no reason not to remain resto.
Sylarae - May 3, 2006 12:53 AM (GMT)
well the comunity is up in arms over this (imagine, that same group that goes druid bashing because of how pathetic they are in terms of DPS without large mana / talent reservers) but I'd agree. Only now I see my long term dream of a vaible PvE / PvP hybrid spec a little more plausible. If I understand the new 31 talent ability correctly whats the point of TWO instant cast heals? If I can get my act together on my feral armor set, and wrap up my heal effect set I could see myself easily going something to the effect of 30 / 0 / 21. Still I havn't really reviewed my options thoroughly.
Kdorf - May 4, 2006 11:09 PM (GMT)
Ishonbu - May 5, 2006 02:50 PM (GMT)
|QUOTE (Sylarae @ May 2 2006, 08:53 PM)|
| well the comunity is up in arms over this (imagine, that same group that goes druid bashing because of how pathetic they are in terms of DPS without large mana / talent reservers) but I'd agree. Only now I see my long term dream of a vaible PvE / PvP hybrid spec a little more plausible. If I understand the new 31 talent ability correctly whats the point of TWO instant cast heals? If I can get my act together on my feral armor set, and wrap up my heal effect set I could see myself easily going something to the effect of 30 / 0 / 21. Still I havn't really reviewed my options thoroughly. |
Addressing the italics:
The -point- of two instant-cast heals one where you can choose to use a hot (which still ticks afterwards) or healing touch with nature's swiftness on a 3 minute cooldown and one that converts a HOT into a full heal if it's already on your target is immense.
The NS->HT heal is for when you know your target is going to die in 2 seconds (most of the times it's me in a pinch) the new talent is great if you've already got an hot on.. your target takes more damage than you expected and you can give them the full benefit of the HOT instantly... while a priest's renew still ticks away on them giving them an hot as well.
There have been plenty of times where a tick of rejuv or regrowth was not quite enough to keep someone alive in the midst of battle. I see the new talent spell as something to give restos another "oh shit" button and make their HoT somewhat like a flash heal.
Popping rank 11 rejuv and then turning it into a full heal would be great for a non MT person who was losing health.. regrowth has a shorter cast time than ht so turning that into a full heal just made it more efficient especially if the NS timer isn't up yet. It gives a spell that's dedicated to changing solely healing spells into instants so you can use your NS to quick sleep something, quick root something or quick rez someone and still have an instant heal in your bag for emergencies.
Also, just to clarify, are you saying you'd go balance and resto if you had a suitable feral/healing set?
30/0/21 -> B/F/R
Ayngle - May 5, 2006 06:08 PM (GMT)
30/0/21? Have you completely lost your mind? I cant see a single benefit to that spec. None at all.
Anyway you seem to be in the "Druids heal only" mentality still. Like Bu said this 31 will free NS up for all kinds of happy casting tricks (Roots in AQ comes to mind really freaking quick) not to mention the obvious advantages it gives to the resto with all the happy "My heals generate less agro" talents.
But back to the important stuff.... 30/0/21? was that supposed to be 0/30/21?
Sylarae - May 17, 2006 12:10 AM (GMT)
XD alright alright, I conceed. This whole time I've been testing the viablity to the best of my skill both feral and hybrid builds. Thus far I have only seen advantages to the builds once or twice, and only in WSG. That said when I said 30 / 0 / 21 I really meant 30 / 0 /21. Granted I can grasp why I threw you all off. My apologies.
At that, I've been a bit of a fool when it comes to my talent builds. The entire point I went into feral was for the +10% armor bonus until I had some armor items like the unyielding maul to cover the difference and respec for more DPS on the side.
@ ayn: I do not have the "druids are for healing" mind set. In fact I find myself crying over people who do keep that mind set. I am in the "druids can DPS, but its hard and there isn't as extensive a DPS armor and weapon tree available to druids in the end game as say....rogues."
Also, be nice. I happen to find advantages to speccing in Balance. It makes spell based DPS more viable, and the 21 - 31 talent gap in restoration is two talents that make healing easier in my eyes (one of them drops mana costs, the other boosts healing affects) and innervate. Further more I find nature's swiftness more useful that moonkin form. Thus far I've healed fine without another NEW healing spell in small 5 man instances. I can can even go as far as to say that the vast majority of the time when a group wipes its not my fault. Heck as far as ZG goes to the best of my knowledge I am a decent healer. I'm just not used to having to compete with every other healer in the raid for healing scores, and at that I am an SUV when it comes to healing. Going back to those 5 man instances if its an average pull, or more you can imagin that I'll go LOM or OOM before the battle resolves...I got a lot of work to do I know.
Either way everything I've been talking about spec-wise is pure speculation. I will be giving the new heal a solid testing before I change specs. Either way I will be getting rid of my feral element. I've determind that I certainly managed to do everything I did before I spec'd feral only now I dont have all the balance DPS I used to enjoy with only 20 talents invested.
EDIT: at that does anyone know of a solid balance druid guide? So far I've only read the one posted on the druid forums on the WoW website, but that mostly tells you what items to equip and so on.
Chiela - June 13, 2006 02:07 PM (GMT)
Hey, I just joined TFW and I'm always looking for some good druidic knowledge. I'm probably gonna send you all in game tells and such, but I just thought I'd say hi here first. In addition, I'm trying out a 35/0/16 B/F/R build. That's right, oomkin. If you have any advice for me or if you'd like to talk about it, just post here or whisper me in game.
Sylarae - June 27, 2006 09:11 AM (GMT)
D: you beat me to the punch! I`m considering my options, right now I`m 20 / 0 /31 but I still need to test out the new 31 resto talent before I decide if I want to keep that or shift more toward balance.
All I can think of is that the act of speccing in balance doesn`t mean you can`t / Shouldn`t heal or go feral. It only means you`ll do those less effectively than a druid with a shifting spec. I`ve been digging around but I can`t find any sound advice on what balance druids NEED to do to be great. Still, one of the perks of moonkin form is that you DO have a stronger option for going after cloth armor...assuming you can find it.
Looking forward to seeing you in raids....when I manage to show up.
Chiela - June 27, 2006 12:32 PM (GMT)
Yeah, I'm still kinda learning how to play a oomkin myself. However, it's nice that a lot of the gear I collect translates to both healing and damage. It's a lot better than going feral :P. Whisper me in game and we can talk about it.
Shanachie - June 27, 2006 01:42 PM (GMT)
I sincerely take offense to that. :angry:
Terrem - June 27, 2006 02:12 PM (GMT)
Chiela - June 27, 2006 02:12 PM (GMT)
*cuddles original chie*
So, how do you balance the stats needed for healing or feral shredding? Is there a set of gear you have which lets you do both fairly effectively?
Ishonbu - June 27, 2006 04:03 PM (GMT)
The thing about all flavors of druids is... we have to have -specific- armor for each situation we're in otherwise we're not doing our best at that spec. Now some of the new AQ rewards have tried to have an overall bonus with feral flavor. The updated pvp gear also tries to balance things out for good or for ill.
Ask any druid and they'll give you a wishlist of things for their spec, for their off-spec, for grinding, for dancing, for faceshredding...
Chiela - June 27, 2006 05:04 PM (GMT)
Yeah, Druids need a lot of gear do play our many roles. The newer sets like feralheart and genesis have tried to combine what we need, but they fall short in a lot of ways.
After rereading my first post today, I want to clarify that I don't look down on feral specs. I leveled as feral, I love feral and I feel I was, at times, more effective as a feral. I don't think that balance specs are better than feral, just that sometimes the class gear translates a bit better into our non-healing aspects. *continues hugging chie*
Sylarae - July 1, 2006 02:41 PM (GMT)
*shrug* I admit, I flat out hate alot of feral druids. Its not personal, and it doesn`t apply to ALL. I`ve have feral tanks in LBRS and so on, and I respect the feral class. Its when they tell me that they absolutely refuse to do anything but DPS / Tank even though they`ve already proven their IN-ability in the given role.
Chiela - July 1, 2006 02:47 PM (GMT)
So, I'm considering a respec. This is my current build: http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=Mx0xcMEstZxgco
It has all the balance goodies that I want (well, I think I wanna swap imp. thorns for imp. roots, but that's not a big deal), but I'm feeling like it's light on the resto side.
Here are the other builds I'm considering:
The "still moonkin but more resto" build:http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=Mtcx0MxstZxecoc
The healing efficiency build:http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=Mxcx0MxsZZxgcoeoM
The resto/balance build:http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=Mxcx0MxZZxEcoeoMo
What do you all think would make me most effective? Are there talents I'm not spending well? I'd like to get some advice before I actually respec :)