Sadly, I feel I must qualify the following statement with the fact that I have been an avid supernatural addict since season 1. I have watched this show religiously and turned many onto it as well due to its distinct level of sheer awesomeness.

With that being said and while I loved most of the opening of Season 7, I feel like I've gotta say this here since the fan-base that frequents these forums seems to be pretty intelligent (the regulars, that is ). While I have never posted here before I have read many others' posts and find them insightful.

Ok, so to the point...sorry for the rambling...

Is there really a need for the writers of the show to work in their own political viewpoints all the time??? This past episode sent me over the edge with the whole gay rights thing and then the very obvious shot at Michelle Bachmann and Scott Walker.

Listen, I'm an independent. I realize you may hold your views and would hope you realize that I can hold my own as well. You agree with what they are showing? Good for you! I just find it incredibly hypocritical given the entire premise of the show and the characters in it.

Why is everyone ignoring the absolute and utter joke it is that a show based around characters who a possess a multitude of firearms, avoid the law at all costs, impersonate federal officials, are from middle America, obviously believe in God, drive an awesome, yet horrifically bad gas guzzler in the Impala, and finally (though there are more examples) both of whom have the whole "I'm a manly-man" bravado thing going on would consistently push a very leftist view of the country on multiple occasions (not just this episode)?

On to this shows specific examples;

Gay Rights - At first, I thought they were ripping the Westboro Baptist Church (totally acceptable in my opinion and very many more I would assume), but then the pastor's sermon focused on gay rights. Ok, sure, maybe Castiel's view (do angels have a view on these things?) is different from God's view in the Supernatural universe?? I guess I can see that if that's what they were trying to say, but I just found it to be a very volatile view for the writers to choose to represent with their ONE example of Castiel cleaning house on hypocritical pastors. On top of that, Castiel explicitly states he's indifferent to sexual orientation, so I don't think I can give the writers that much credit.

Cas does mention he hates hypocrites though, so maybe the point was that the pastor was either gay himself, molesting some kids, or hooking up with one of the women in his congregation? Who knows, but I just found it way too political for the type of show this is supposed to be.

Michelle Walker - This is laughable at best. It's a clear shot at combining Michelle Bachmann and Scott Walker together into a character that they can mock. Reading too far into it you may say? I don't think so.

Why would Cas show up at her campaign office if she weren't in the wrong in his view? Cas claims abuse of power against a woman who causes poverty and despair in God's name...Are there corrupt politicians? Of course! Are the writers clearly trying to make the comparison to establish that very thought in the minds of their viewers? Seems very clear to me that is exactly what they're trying to do.

Now trying to look at this from the other side makes me think another thing. Could Cas waking up from his Leviathan-blackout and seeing what he did to all those people been what made realize he was going too far? That seems like it would make sense to me, but again, why the combination of those names? Why not something more generic that doesn't take the names of two prominent republicans? Or here's an idea! How about you combine a democrat AND a republican's name together for that character? (Please don't mention that our first lady's first name is Michelle either. She's not a politician herself AND the writers intent is clear on the likeness of Bachmann).

Either way, sorry for the long rant, but this has been bugging me since Friday night. When I re-watched the episode, I found these two scenes and their obvious political message really distracting me from the episode itself.

Bottom line in my opinion; keep making a great show great, but please leave out the political garbage from one side or the other. I watch this show because I like the characters, the mythology, the classic cars, and the classic rock. I do not watch this show to have some over-reaching, Hollywood-leftist writer use their position to push their own political views on me. Is that too much to ask?

Here's to another season of Supernatural. Hoping that this political garbage doesn't continue to ruin a show I love to watch. I'm sure some will jump down my throat for the post, but someone had to say it...

Naw, no one will jump down your throat--disagree maybe but you're safe

I can understand your irritation but to be honest, this show isn't the only one that pulls current issues into it nor will it be the last. You know what my favorite quote this year is?

"America needs to get a sense of humor" by none other than Herman Cain. He said this after making a statement that was done in jest but the media picked up and began to run as if he was serious.

So for me, I kind of take the little digs writers put into shows with a grain of salt. They're entitled to their opinions and to be honest I won't be changing my view based on what they say.

So while the writers do take pot shots at political and even historical figures or also address some of the issues that we face today, I don't take it as them giving a sermon on the mount but maybe more as them trying to inject humor into what is admittedly a stressed out world now.

Besides, you yourself indicated that if they make fun of certain groups (Westborough Church) that would be okay because it is a group you don't like or maybe empathize with. So when making references to public figures and or current issues, someone may always be offended depending on how they feel about that person or issue. Sure they take risks at offending some viewers but then in a sense after tackling Angels, Demons and God, I don't think the show will back down from other sensitive subjects if they feel it fits into the story.

Actually, its funny but I also thought they were referring to the Westborough Church group as well so maybe they were. However, the message I really took from that scene was the hypocritical nature of the preacher passing judgement on others.

I actually didn't catch the blending of the political names, but then since a lot of people now adays feel that politicians do abuse power, I'm not sure it would have bothered me as much. I just saw the person as a politician and not any specific person. It doesn't surprise me that they picked Republicans as a lot of Hollywood folks are Democratic. But it could also be because the Republicans are more in the headlines now due to the primaries. Once again, just the way I look at it. But I can see if you like either of those candidates how it might bother you. By the way I'm an Independent as well

The fact is Hollywood in general will always use the media to put forth their own ideas on current issues and public figures. I guess for me, I've just learned to kind of tune it out and enjoy the show I'm watching. Because in the end, it's simply their point of view, which like me, they are entitled to.

Who? I barely know who the SD Governor is and I can't spell his name, I know Stephanie is out and Kristi is in but other than that don't know, don't care.

I didn't get why Cas was upset with the Congresswoman but then, to me, every Senator and House member is fair game. I hate politics with an upbridled passion, I also hate people like the Reverend - preaching hate and intolerance while, according to Cas, actually secretly fulfilling his own vices. The Westborough Church and Churches like them need to pointed at, laughed at and poked fun at otherwise they tick me off to much and I just want to smack them with a clue-x-four.

I thought that was hilarious! And the KKK having to disband -big thumbs up-

Well said, Raven. I agree.

Also found this from a link in the Spoiler section talking about Castiel's 10 Commandments. lol

[spoiler=spoiler]http://www.tvguide.com/News/Supernatural-C...ts-1037969.aspx[/spoiler]

But on the other flip side of that coin Kyle why not have the Black Panthers disband as well, considering they are just as much of a hate group as the KKK is. But I know why they didn't say that because people would be claiming that's racist, so it's easier to poke fun at the KKK instead.

I see what the OP is saying, and I agree with her somewhat, however; for the most part I tend to ignore them cause if I let it all bother me I would be stressed out....


April

This post has been edited by Freyja on Sep 28 2011, 01:54 AM

If the Black Panthers had been mentioned in the show and after looking them up to make sure they are who I think they are, I would have given Cas another big thumbs up, Freyja.

Oh I know you would have Kyle, my question was more hypothetical...

Instead of just adding the KKK they should have had both lol is how I should have said it.

April

Frankly, I enjoy having narrow minded, selfish political folks get some digs---they deserve it IMO The writers don't always please me , but in that they do

I like that show is bold in that regard, and doesn't hold to being politically correct. If big fish are doing bad things, then I like them calling them on it.

The entire heaven and hell scenario is ripe with potential to offend, and yet they are simply telling a story, not setting religious mandates.

I wouldn't say that I'm a liberal left-winger, but the ones they've made targets of have certainly deserved the scrutiny IMHO. I too looked at the political lady as the embodiment of all 'bad' politicians, not anyone in particular.

If anything, I like that Supernatural makes us stop on occasion and ponder the choices man makes, the moral dilemmas and the trade-offs in determining what is right and where that line is. I love their examination of the grey areas, and how seemingly good men can be bad and bad creatures might be good.

I most loved Jus in Bello, for Dean's stand against doing the "smart" thing, instead holding that one life was as important as many, and deciding that they weren't going to surrender their humanity.

I like that Supernatural inspires discussion and debate. That's always a good thing, but at the end of the day it is entertainment.

B.J.

I didn't realize it was poking fun at a specific person either... At first I thought maybe it was Sarah Palin (see ITE) but she hasn't announced candidacy yet.

I don't want to start an argument here about this, but I'm going to use it to support Raven's point about perspective. Dean fought to save Nancy - which was a humane thing to do - however saving Nancy cost the lives of others. Was it still the right thing? Whether something is right or wrong, offensive or not is subjective.

ITA

I have found some things said on the show offensive. The term "off the reservation" is very racist at it's core. It's a reference to American Indians leaving the reservations. "Short bus" which they use a lot (which I had never heard until SN) is a derogatory term related to people who are physically and/or mentally challenged The portrayal of witches, while not offensive to me, could be to some...

Ya just gotta pick your battles. The show hasn't done anything I found so offensive as to make want to stop watching...

I understand what you all are saying and I have no problem with most of it, however; what I think the OP is trying to say is make it a bit more balanced.

If you are gonna pick on someone from the right which they have a lot, they need to pick on someone from the left (but they won't and never do)

Meaning- there have been a ton of Cheney, Palin, Christianity and other Conservative jokes. But nothing about Atheists, AL Gore or Anthony Wiener... It's easier for people on the left to poke fun on those they disagree with and 99.5% of Hollywood is Left... As an Independent it sorta irks me... (SPN isn't the only show to do it, SVU- Special Victims Unit does it too)

Do I like their portrayal of the Gods/Goddess on SPN as a Pagan no, but Eric did give an explanation once and after I read that I am okay with it, cause he made a good case...

April

This post has been edited by Freyja on Sep 28 2011, 04:01 PM

Great perspective from many of you. Thanks for that!

Like some have said, I would love to just see some balance myself, especially given what the main characters stand for on a lot of issues. Either way I'll continue to watch, but like I said in my original post, if these things continue, it's going to signal the end of an awesome show for me as typical Hollywood will have butchered it.

This is exactly what I was saying! Thanks Freyja!

Well, ha! I'm going to throw my two cents in.

Cas is clearly one of those wishy washy Episcopalian Gods with a liberal agenda. Over here in Canada most of us in the mainstream churches feel that God doesn't care what you do with your genitals either. ---

But some do. However, maybe the conservatives and fundamentalists here are different from the conservatives and fundamentalists in the US because I've never heard of a church that pickets weddings and funerals and I found that a bit absurd. If they did it would not just be sick but illegal. Still, I guess they were targeting the "Aids is punishment for sin" Jerry Fallwell legacy type of crap that does happen in some places.

And cute little churches like that packed to capacity? Never happens.

As clergy in a mainstream church, I didn't find it offensive - because hey, SN is offensive because SN is offensive and they are that way with a lot of groups, although I agree, they do tend to leave out certain ones. But what I found was that it was more annoying than anything because in some regards they are perpetuating a stereotype and it's so prevalent that its almost cliche. I do know there are US churches that are into the whole dinosaurs playing with kids things - but there is another reality too which never gets any attention: social justice, bioethics, environmental stewardship, etc.

With the politician I didn't realize they might be making fun of Sarah Palin - whose greatest gift to the world IMO was giving Tina Fey a reason to make us laugh, while cringing that this is someone who might actually be seen as a legitimate political candidate.

Oh wait - maybe they are performing a public service.

But seriously, I would like a little more balance too. Less stereotypes and charicitures all around, would I think, make SN a bit more intelligent. In the Christian portrayals, I always thought they were bang on in the episode about the dead priest who thought he was an angel. The priest who was left alive and struggling to care for an inner city neighborhood was way more bang on.

Maybe it's just me...but if you were really Independent would it matter whom was made fun of as long as attention was being called to the inanity?

It is very true that both sides have their mouth piece of embarrassment....but if I'm honest, it's easier for me to note "right wingers" (as a broad generalization lets say) than left. Are they out there...absolutely. Are they as loud....doesn't seem like it. And from the stand point of the SN writer..it's a buzz topic - because let's face it, this show is HIGHLY referential and some of it is topical.

My point is, I'm not sure that it's a secret plot to take shots at any certain political or religious group any more than Jon Stewart...it's merely to get a laugh. Is it going to appeal to everyone? No, because that's impossible, will they hit a majority percentage.. probably.

Either way I'm just glad anyone is making fun of the crazies trying to run the country on paper thin promises and outmoded ideals, no matter who they are.