New York Giants, 2005 NFC East Champions

I would like to start this thread for the 2 or 3 Giants fans that regularly inhabit this site by addressing one thing...


The reasons why Ernie Accorsi picked Matthias Kiwanuka with their 1st round pick.


Frankly, I can't think of any intelligent reason. NOT ONE. I watched the Ernie interview on ESPN in which he said you can never have enough pass rushers. Umm... Ernie? YES, YOU CAN! Why did he use 2 of the only 4 picks they had in 2005 on DEs? Is something wrong with 1st team All-Pro Osi Umenyiora? Is he not re-signing 2nd team All-Pro Michael Strahan at the end of the 2006 season? Did Justin Tuck look incapable of playing the position last season? Why did he draft Eric Moore, then keep him on the roster all season when he was unable to play forcing them to put players like Carlos Emmons on IR? This move is completely ridiculous. It would be like the Pats using their first round pick on a QB when Tom Brady is in his prime.

Accorsi made an excellent move trading down and acquiring PITTs 3rd and 4th rounders. For some insane reason, he trades THE GIANTS 3RD ROUNDER to get Sinorice Moss. I like Moss and think he's an excellent pick. They should've used the damn 32nd pick on him if they wanted him. Now, they've traded down for a player they had no use for at all, traded up for a player they could've picked at 32, and lost their good 3rd rounder in the process. Now all they have to show for the trade down is the equivalent of three(3) 4th round picks!

Ernie really screwed up today... BADLY.

first day of the draft is over. i was in shock during the kiwi pick, but am starting to warm up a little bit. loved the moss pick and think wilkenson was a decent pick up.

i need to see some needs filled on the second day to really warm up to this draft more, but overall, a decent day.

started another thread by mistake. my bad.

anyway, i agree, kiwi is confusing, but i warmed up to it a little. not much, but a little. i keep telling myself to just think about the pass rush, and it helps a little. moss is the savior of this draft. i have always been a fan of getting more talent around eli, especially a player like moss.

I think Sinorice Moss is an excellent piece for the team. I liked Pat Kirwin's assessment that not too many teams will be able to handle the Giants 3 WR, 1 TE, and 1 RB package this season.

As far as Kiwi goes, I still can't understand it. Ernie's interviews only make it worse. I could see if Justin Tuck looked awful last season, but he was pretty good and was given a lot of playing time. This is just a wasted pick. I would've preferred ANYTHING else other than a DE. ANYTHING.

Wilkerson is filler. There were a few DTs available at that point that would've been wonderful selections. I just hope he makes the team.

once you get past the fact that kiwi makes absolutely no sense to go to the giants, it feels like a much better pick. let me explain.

im not defending the pick, my god i would have loved to see the giants pick winston justice, but if there is any situation in the NFL right now that is ideal for kiwi, its with the giants.

the problem people had with him comming out was that he had no technique and was inconsistent. playing in a rotation with strahan, tuck, and osi, kiwi is going to just be able to go in the game for a few plays each series, give his all, then come off the field for a breather. hes not going to be out on the field every single play like he was at bost
on college.

as for the technique, he can learn on the bench for a while, from two pro-bowlers no less, imo, what he really needs.

the main thing that i pulled away from the first day is that the giants seem to be thinking look term. all the picks where what they thought had the most value. it also makes sense when you consider they havnt brought in any older players, except madison, for the past few years in free agency.

it really seems like the giants are building up long term, building the core of the team aroung eli on offense and the pass rush on defense. if thats indeed the case, its hard for me to fault them taking kiwi, the player they felt was the best for the team in the future.

Any chance Kiwi gets turned into a big OLB? That's what I thought as the day went on.

Teams won't be able to handle that offense... you know, if they could actually block.

He's too big & too stiff...

i'd be surprised if kiwi becomes a backer. they already have torbor, another converted end that is supposed to be a pass rusher.

i think kiwi fits the mold of the type of ends the giants want, athletic rushers that can get upfield and are occasionally drop into coverage.

My analysis of the draft:



1st Round. Matthias Kiwanuka - After having a day to stew over this pick, I've come to the realization all the players the Giants wanted were gone already. So Accorsi decided to take the highest rated player he had REGARDLESS of need or how the player would help the team this season. Based on those 2 points, Kiwi does nothing. In a few years he could turn out to be a steal. For a win now team, the pick was rather disappointing.

2nd Round. Sinorice Moss - After the shock of the first pick, Moss represented a nice return to reality. Moss helps the team immediately and could develop in to an excellent starter as soon as 2007. His deep speed is great for a team that attempts more passes 20 yards down the field than any team in the league. He also could help the special teams, although Chad Morton (and perhaps Willie Ponder) are returning.

3rd Round. Gerris Wilkinson - This wasn't the sexiest name I've ever heard in the third round, but the kid has some skills. He will play OLB for the Giants. The character issue comes up with him in the fact Accorsi felt the need to mention repeatedly how Wilkinson was a team captain and Academic All-ACC player. I'll give Accorsi the benefit of a doubt on this one considering he has a good history of drafting helpful LBs after the 1st round.

4th Round. Barry Cofield - I like this pick because I've seen him many times in the Big Ten. Cofield can make some plays, but isn't going to conjure images of Jerome Brown. He's solid and has the potential to be a starter in this league.

5th Round. Guy Whimper - This kid apparently has an overabundance of physical skill, but has only played the OT position a short time. He will require a LOT of teaching and technique work, but that's okay for a late pick. Unless he's found smoking crack in the locker room, he will make the team.

6th Round. Charlie Peprah - I'm surprised the Giants drafted a safety at all. With 4 or 5 guys already on the roster, Peprah going to have a tough time making the team. However, if he plays well in training camp, the Giants will find him a spot. That's one of the things I like about this organization. He's more of a run support safety than a pass coverage guy. That doesn't help. He will need to play great on special teams.

7th Round. Gerrick McPhearson - I admit I know nothing about this guy except what I've read in scouting reports. He sounds exactly like Will Allen... loads of speed and a complete inability to play the ball in the air. He's a track guy. With all the corners on the roster, I don't see how he makes the team.

In Ernie Accorsi's final draft before his retirement, he made a GREAT trade in the first round. The problem was he had to trade away the best of the 2 picks to get Moss. The Giants ended up getting only a low 4th rounder for trading down 7 spots in the 1st round. Hopefully, Kiwi will turn into a great pass rusher and a better player than anyone drafted after him. I still can't say I like the pick.

I give the Giants' draft a (C-).

This post has been edited by shockeyisstilldabest on Apr 30 2006, 10:11 PM

Kiwanuka was their highest rated player? That's hard to believe with all the talent that was still on the board...


Jimmy Williams, D'Qwell Jackson, Chad Jackson, Winston Justice, etc, etc


The ONLY way this pick makes sense is if they are expecting Strahan to deteriorate soon and want a replacement, in that case, this pick would be more based on need than on the best player available.



I don't mind Kiwanuka, but whatever they tried to do here, they didn't really do a good job of it.





Nice writeup though

and, y'know, Justin Tuck...

Bump.


Great article on Giants' depth chart going into training camp.

Eric from BBI

Obviously love Kiwi, but that was a dumb pick with the depth they already have (including Awasom, Tuck, and Moore - even though they're moving Moore to LB). They could've waited for someone like Hatcher or Adeyanju or someone like that later on.

Kiwi can and should start for some team right away. He's got a lot to work on, but he's still NFL starting material and will get better rapidly due to his work ethic, athleticism, and his ability to recognize he needs work and his willingness to go out and get help and learn as much as possible... I don't see the logic in this pick other than the Giants just taking a potential threat away from division and conference rivals.

This post has been edited by nepg on Jul 11 2006, 02:37 PM

Kiwi signed.

Sam Madison ran into a deer. His car suffered damage, but he emerged unscathed.

i don't know why, but when i read that (the first sentence) i thought you meant he did it on foot...which would be highly comical

ok...i'll shut up now

This post has been edited by parks on Jul 27 2006, 09:55 PM

What's up with LaVar Arrington's knee? Will he start this year?

Preseason game #1: Giants @ Baltimore Ravens

The Giants looked....ummmm.... AWFUL in their first preseason game of the year. The opening drive for the Ravens was a clinic for Steve McNair, Todd Heap, and Jamal Lewis. William Joseph(:cursing:) and Fred Robbins allowed Antonio Pierce to be hit by seemingly 5 Ravens on every running play. Gibril Wilson was chasing Heap hopelessly on two big pass plays. The pass rush never got that close to the QB. The capper was a TD run by Steve McNair in which he carried 3/three/THREE(!) Giants over the goal line.

As both teams' backups got in, the Ravens still ran the ball pretty well against Giant DTs expected to contribute this season like Barry Cofield and Jonas Seawright. Should someone get Brentson Buckner's phone number? The lone bright spot defensively was Matthias Kiwanuka. He was credited for 1.5 sacks and displayed nice speed to the outside. He still needs to get stronger and work on some other moves. Sam Madison also made a nice defensive play on an underthrown ball by McNair.

Coming into the game, all I really wanted to see was Brandon Jacobs play with the first unit. On the opening carry of the game, Jacobs rumbled for 14 yards including running over an unknown Raven. He had 4 yards and a TD on his next 5 carries. I can't blame him as the Giants' O-line was putrid. That also affected Eli who spent most of his three drives running for his life. He connected on a long pass to Plaxico Burress, which I thought wasn't a catch. The ref reviewed it and said it was a catch... what do I know? Otherwise, Eli wasn't bad.

As far as the backups, I was hoping to see Jared Lorenzen with the mix of 1st and 2nd unit players, but Tim Hasselbeck got that call. He was okay, but he also was running for dear life. Memo to TC: Matt Lentz-G can't make the team, practice squad, or even be allowed to be in the concession stand during a game. Lorenzen was decent with the players who have little or no shot of making the team. He has a solid arm and better than expected mobility. I hope he gets the nod after Eli for the game next week. Players like Mike Jemison-RB and Anthony Mix-WR looked pretty good.

The special teams was average at best, until Michael Jennings made a spectacular run on a 57 yard punt return for TD in the 4th quarter. I'm sure everyone will see the highlight soon. Jay Feely missed a 44 yard FG attempt in the 2nd quarter before making the 29 yard GW FG as the clock expired. I still don't trust him in a big spot over 35 yards.

Now time for everyone's favorite... Excuse Time!

(1) You could start a pretty good team with the Giants who couldn't play, didn't make the trip, or dressed (and didn't play).

Michael Strahan
Tiki Barber
Jeremy Shockey
Chris Snee
Lavar Arrington
Sinorice Moss
Carlos Emmons
Brandon Short
Jeff Feagles

(2) The Giants showed up for this game without so much as a single scrimmage against another team and it showed. The Ravens were ready to play and the Giants seemed to be figuring out what the rules of American Football were.

Oh yeah... the Giants won 17-16.

This post has been edited by shockeyisstilldabest on Aug 12 2006, 12:38 AM

Shouldn't let Kendrick Clancy go!

Just figured I should place my name amongst the fellow Giants fans.